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It's been since the end of August that Ms. Prata last appeared here, which has been a welcome respite. She represents herself as a Bible teacher, but as we have discovered over and over, she is just not competent to do this. We don't wish to be disrespectful, but it's important to understand that her Bible teaching ought not be trusted.
It's been since the end of August that Ms. Prata last appeared here, which has been a welcome respite. She represents herself as a Bible teacher, but as we have discovered over and over, she is just not competent to do this. We don't wish to be disrespectful, but it's important to understand that her Bible teaching ought not be trusted.
At little over 2000 words this is a scattershot explanation. It is all over the map, jumping from topic to topic with no explanation or reason. Ms. Prata makes a series of assertions as if they are relevant, but never explores them or even documents them. Frankly, it's only because of our extensive study of cessationism that this even makes sense.
And that's the bottom line. One must be steeped in certain cessationist doctrines to be able to understand Ms. Prata's superficial presentation.
We must deem this Bad Bible Teaching.
We discuss Muslim dreams here.
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SYNOPSIS
The essay argues that while God used dreams during Christ’s advent and occasionally in Scripture, revelatory dreams ceased with the completed biblical canon. Claims of divine dreams, including Muslim visions, contradict Scripture’s sufficiency and misapply Joel and Acts, affirming Scripture alone as God’s final revelation.
Many word-faith false preachers (More gratuitous mentions...)
It gets confusing for people because we are indeed in the “last days”. (The confusion actually results when people like Ms. Prata try to explain why verses that contradict their doctrines don't actually mean what they say.)
The Joel prophecy and Peter’s restatement of it lay the foundation for the beginning of the last days. As we know, it has been 2000+ years since Jesus was born, lived, died, and was resurrected. And it is not over yet. So it is the beginning of the last days, and there is more to come. Indeed, see Joel 2:28 again,
SYNOPSIS
The essay argues that while God used dreams during Christ’s advent and occasionally in Scripture, revelatory dreams ceased with the completed biblical canon. Claims of divine dreams, including Muslim visions, contradict Scripture’s sufficiency and misapply Joel and Acts, affirming Scripture alone as God’s final revelation.
(...) redacted long, irrelevant explanation
There was some discussion on social media in which I was involved where the issue of the Muslims receiving dreams from a ‘being’ or ‘a man in white’ that some say is the Muslim version of Jesus, called Isa. In this scenario, apparently a man in white comes to a Muslim in a dream and tells him that something is going to happen, like, Bibles will arrive, or someone one will share the Gospel. In some of these dreams, the gospel is allegedly given right in the dream.
I had said, no. The canon is closed (This is one of two times Ms. Prata will mention the closed canon [the other is in the redacted portion], but she will never explain why it's relevant to her position on dreams.
There was some discussion on social media in which I was involved where the issue of the Muslims receiving dreams from a ‘being’ or ‘a man in white’ that some say is the Muslim version of Jesus, called Isa. In this scenario, apparently a man in white comes to a Muslim in a dream and tells him that something is going to happen, like, Bibles will arrive, or someone one will share the Gospel. In some of these dreams, the gospel is allegedly given right in the dream.
I had said, no. The canon is closed (This is one of two times Ms. Prata will mention the closed canon [the other is in the redacted portion], but she will never explain why it's relevant to her position on dreams.
We discuss the closed canon here.)
and Jesus is not appearing or sending an angel to appear to Muslims as a method of conversion. Matthew 28’s The Great Commission outlines how we are to evangelize and receiving dreams is not it. (Let's quote it:
Mt. 28:19-20 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you.
Obviously, there is no discussion of dreams here, or even that there is some sort of exclusive methodology that defines the process of salvation.)
You would not believe the pushback such a stance sparks. People want to believe in these dreams, or in general, that God or Jesus is still sending dreams to whoever. Beth Moore (Gratuitous mention of a person Ms. Prata doesn't like.)
You would not believe the pushback such a stance sparks. People want to believe in these dreams, or in general, that God or Jesus is still sending dreams to whoever. Beth Moore (Gratuitous mention of a person Ms. Prata doesn't like.)
claimed to have a dreamy type vision where she claimed to be lifted up into another dimension to see the global church “as Jesus sees it”. And apparently the global church included the apostate Catholic Church, too.
Many word-faith false preachers (More gratuitous mentions...)
teach that God still communicates thorough dreams, something for example, Jesse Duplantis regularly teaches and claims to have had these dreams himself. Kris Vallotton of Bethel College, Benny Hinn, Bill Wommack, and Bill Johnson also teach that receiving dreams are a normal part of the Christian life. Mormons also teach that their elders receive dreams. (What these people believe or do not believe is not relevant to Ms. Prata's obligation to make the biblical case.)
The one New Testament verse many point to in order to substantiate their stance that divine dreams continue and contain new or even prophetic revelation is from Acts 2:17,
The one New Testament verse many point to in order to substantiate their stance that divine dreams continue and contain new or even prophetic revelation is from Acts 2:17,
‘AND IT SHALL BE IN THE LAST DAYS,’ God says, ‘THAT I WILL POUR OUT MY SPIRIT ON ALL MANKIND; AND YOUR SONS AND YOUR DAUGHTERS WILL PROPHESY, AND YOUR YOUNG MEN WILL SEE VISIONS, AND YOUR OLD MEN WILL HAVE DREAMS;
It is in all caps because the Acts verse is quoting an Old Testament prophecy from Joel 2:28, which says,
“It will come about after this That I will pour out My Spirit on all mankind; And your sons and your daughters will prophesy, Your old men will have dreams, Your young men will see visions.
It gets confusing for people because we are indeed in the “last days”. (The confusion actually results when people like Ms. Prata try to explain why verses that contradict their doctrines don't actually mean what they say.)
It is stated so in Hebrews 1:2; 1 John 2:18; 1 Peter 1:20 state so. These days began at the coming of Jesus. The last days will end when He returns and renders judgment and the 1000 year kingdom begins. (Undocumented claim.)
The Joel prophecy and Peter’s restatement of it lay the foundation for the beginning of the last days. As we know, it has been 2000+ years since Jesus was born, lived, died, and was resurrected. And it is not over yet. So it is the beginning of the last days, and there is more to come. Indeed, see Joel 2:28 again,
It will come about after this That I will pour out My Spirit on all mankind; [underline mine).
Has that happened? Has God sent His Spirit to ALL mankind? No. Only repentant believers in Jesus.(Actually, yes. God has poured out His Spirit as the prophecy promised. The Greek word for "pour out" is ekcheo, which means
gush forth, pour out, shed, spill.
all, any, every, the whole
a living creature.
Let's put it together. At Pentecost the Holy Spirit was poured out, gushed "in the direction of" every single living creatures. It does not mean the Holy Spirit has made everyone born again or is living in every soul. Ms. Prata seems to think the Holy Spirit has not been poured out because of her misinterpretation of this verse. However, "poured out" is not "indwelling."
The Holy Spirit must be poured out in order for it to be possible for His indwelling presence, which is necessary for salvation:
Ro. 8:9 You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.
Jesus promised He would send the Holy Spirit when He left:
Jn. 16:7-8 But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Counsellor will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. 8 When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt...
This pouring out, similar to a wash of baptismal water, would happen very soon:
Ac. 1:5 For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.
And it did, and that's why Peter was explaining.
But if it's true the Holy Spirit has not been poured out as of yet, then no one has been saved. Relegating the poured out Holy Spirit to some future time robs Him of His present day ministry, not only salvation but also the Church, spiritual gifts, and the ordinances as well.
It is because of this serious misunderstanding that Ms. Prata feels the need to construct a completely different doctrine, which she will continue to try to explain.)
This verse is intended for the Millennium Kingdom, when all mortal people who survived the Tribulation enter the kingdom after judgment. This initial population of the Millennium Kingdom will all be believers and all will be given the Spirit. (Notice that Ms. Prata just makes this up. The Acts passage does not say this, and in fact there is no Bible verse that says this.
That's why she does not document her assertion.)
Now look at Joel 2:30, just 2 verses after the verse that people use to claim dreams are a normal part of the faith in these days.
I will display wonders in the sky and on the earth, Blood, fire, and columns of smoke. The sun will be turned into darkness, And the moon into blood, Before the great and awesome day of the LORD comes.
Has that happened yet? No. When Peter at Pentecost said it is the last days, it is, but it is the BEGINNING of the last days. (Ms. Prata's argument is that interpreting this prophecy requires one of two things; either it's all fulfilled at once, or it is sequentially fulfilled according to her eschatology. We reject this false choice.
If one reads the prophecy naturally, without preconception, it's rather easy to see that Joel was describing a scenario by naming particular features of it. Joel was not laying out a sequence so much as he was painting a picture. That means that dreams and visions, as well as wonders in the heaven, fire and smoke, and a moon of blood are all part of the picture as to what constitutes the last days, and they all will happen before the coming of the great and glorious day of the Lord.
We must also consider Peter's context. He was answering the accusations of drunkenness because of the unusual events of Pentecost. That is, "here's why those weird things happened." Peter's defense is that Joel said they would happen. They are evidence of the poured out Spirit in the Last Days.
The evidence and result of the poured out Spirit is the promise of widespread prophecy, dreams, and visions. What was formerly restricted to a very select few is now widely available. All mankind, not just a handful of OT prophets:
He. 1:1-2 In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe.
This conclusion is unavoidable. The evidence of the Last Days is prophecy, dreams, and visions.)
According to the Bible, the last days have begun. No one knows when they will end, though.
If people who insist that revelatory dreams are happening in these days of the church age, they need to reconcile it with the verse in 2 Timothy 3:16-17 that says,
All Scripture is inspired by God and beneficial for teaching, for rebuke, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man or woman of God may be fully capable, equipped for every good work.
Note the words that are absolutes, intensifiers: ALL, FULLY, EVERY. If we still need dreams to advise or reveal, then the 2 Timothy 3 verses fail. (??? This is makes no sense. What does the utility of the Bible have to do with dreams? Why would 2 Timothy fail if the Joel prophecy is true? This is inexplicable, and a horrible non sequitur.)
Matthew Henry’s Complete Commentary says of the verse, so eloquently,
What is the excellency of the scripture. It is given by inspiration of God (v. 16), and therefore is his word. It is a divine revelation, which we may depend upon as infallibly true. The same Spirit that breathed reason into us breathes revelation among us: For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man, but holy men spoke as they were moved or carried forth by the Holy Ghost, 2 Pt. 1:21. It is profitable to us for all the purposes of the Christian life, for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. It answers all the ends of divine revelation. It instructs us in that which is true, reproves us for that which is amiss, directs us in that which is good. It is of use to all, for we all need to be instructed, corrected, and reproved: it is of special use to ministers, who are to give instruction, correction, and reproof; and whence can they fetch it better than from the scripture? Whatever duty we have to do, whatever service is required from us, we may find enough in the scriptures to furnish us for it. If we consult the scripture, which was given by inspiration of God, and follow its directions, we shall be made men of God, perfect, and thoroughly furnished to every good work. [4.] There is no occasion for the writings of the philosopher, nor for rabbinical fables, nor popish legends, nor unwritten traditions, to make us perfect men of God, since the scripture answers all these ends and purposes.” –end Matthew Henry (Yes, yes. All of this is quite true, but completely irrelevant.)
With this truth so eloquently explained, why would one who has the pure Spirit in them consider vain dreams to be as holy and inspired as the sure word of God? ("Vain?" What? How does Ms. Prata know that all dreams are vain? She hasn't even discussed this, let alone proved it.)
What lack is there in a person’s mind when they set the holy word aside in favor of insubstantial nighttime conceits? (??? Again, this has not even been discussed, let alone proved. Ms. Prata has yet to explain why the existence of the Bible somehow comes to bear on prophecy, dreams, or visions.)
Remember, satan can counterfeit signs and miracles.
No, Hebrews 1:1-2 reaffirms the 2 Timothy stance. It says,
No, Hebrews 1:1-2 reaffirms the 2 Timothy stance. It says,
God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom He also made the world. (??? We are even more confused. What does the usefulness of Scripture have to do with Jesus being the pinnacle of God's revelation?)
Matthew 28:18-20 confirms the method by which we are to be saved. So does Romans 10:14. There is no other name by which we may be saved says Acts 4:12. Not Isa, not Man in White. (Ms. Prata continues to make assertions without explanation or context.)
1 Corinthians 13:8 makes it clear that the revelatory spiritual gift such as prophecies (it is understood that this includes prophecies given in dreams) will pass away. (Indeed, quite true. But when will they pass away? We discuss "the perfect" [1 Cor. 13:10] in depth here. Suffice to say, 1 Cor. 13:8-10 does not tell us that prophecy, dreams, visions, etc., have ceased.)
All scripture is sufficient!
All scripture is sufficient!
All scripture is sufficient! (Another inexplicable assertion, repeated emphatically. Why is the sufficiency of Scripture relevant to dreams, visions, and prophecy? Up until this point she has not even discussed sufficiency.
What a nightmare. It's like Ms. Prata is pulling random sentences out of her mind and piecing them together as if they mean something.
We discuss sufficiency in detail here.)
Does God still speak through dreams? (spoiler: No.) (This link doesn't quote a single word of the Bible. It's nothing more than an undocumented opinion.)
If you would like to explore why the ‘Muslim dreams’ issue from a biblical standpoint, here is a two-part series at Gary Gilley’s site, Think on These Things.
In part 1, “This is part two of the article by Pastor Dennis McBride on Muslim dreams and visions of Isa (Jesus). In the June/July publication of TOTT, Pastor McBride discussed the four representative descriptions of the Muslim dreams phenomenon and examined the first 10 primary considerations of this subject. In this publication he will finish discussing the primary considerations and conclude his thoughts.”
An Evaluation of Muslim Dreams & Visions of Isa (Jesus) Part 1 (This link also does not quote Scripture. The author makes the same points as Ms. Prata, but it's much better stated, which makes us wonder why Ms. Prata bothered at all.)
Does God still speak through dreams? (spoiler: No.) (This link doesn't quote a single word of the Bible. It's nothing more than an undocumented opinion.)
If you would like to explore why the ‘Muslim dreams’ issue from a biblical standpoint, here is a two-part series at Gary Gilley’s site, Think on These Things.
In part 1, “This is part two of the article by Pastor Dennis McBride on Muslim dreams and visions of Isa (Jesus). In the June/July publication of TOTT, Pastor McBride discussed the four representative descriptions of the Muslim dreams phenomenon and examined the first 10 primary considerations of this subject. In this publication he will finish discussing the primary considerations and conclude his thoughts.”
An Evaluation of Muslim Dreams & Visions of Isa (Jesus) Part 1 (This link also does not quote Scripture. The author makes the same points as Ms. Prata, but it's much better stated, which makes us wonder why Ms. Prata bothered at all.)
In this second part, he finishes discussing the primary considerations and concludes his thoughts.
An Evaluation of Muslim Dreams & Visions of Isa (Jesus) Part 2 (In this link the author finally quotes Scripture. His fatal mistake, however, is that he assumes that the prophecies, dreams and visions mentioned in the NT are the only prophecies, dreams and visions that ever happened.
An Evaluation of Muslim Dreams & Visions of Isa (Jesus) Part 2 (In this link the author finally quotes Scripture. His fatal mistake, however, is that he assumes that the prophecies, dreams and visions mentioned in the NT are the only prophecies, dreams and visions that ever happened.
This is an Argument From Silence, an argument from what the Bible does not say. We deal with this fallacy here.)
Here is Pastor John MacArthur explaining what happened at Pentecost and how it relates to Joel’s prophecy:
Peter’s Sermon: Explaining Pentecost (Dr. MacArthur makes the very same points. But at least he was honest in that he admitted several times, "I don't know.")
Justin Peters’ 1-minute 45-second video on Muslim dreams: https://youtu.be/VxpkOA6cOME?si=0ZCX4nPjYYgJ_ry4
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