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We would certainly concede the author's premise that she is not being divisive by defending correct doctrine. Our question is, can a person have the truth and correct doctrine and still be divisive? The answer to this question, which the author does not consider, is yes.
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Sometimes you’ve just got to laugh at the ways people use God’s Word to advance unbiblical ideas. I thought I’d heard all the Scriptures people employ in efforts to shame those who call out false teachers and/or expose erroneous doctrine, (This is the author's innocuous characterization of the efforts of the Doctrinal Police. Commendably, the author herself is generally more circumspect and polite than some of the more insulting, demeaning, and hateful ones. For example,
but someone recently broadsided me with a passage I generally use to support calling out enemies of the truth. Look at the passage that she hurled at me:
By warning against Beth Moore, Rick Warren, Holy Yoga, the Roman Catholic Church, etc, I am engaging in foolish controversies and stirring up division. (Again, did the author's interlocutor tell her this, or is she inserting a self-justifying characterization?)
But am I?
Let’s review the Bible Study I wrote on this very passage back in 2017, shall we? Hopefully we’ll remember the historical context behind this passage and thus better understand Paul’s actual point.
Paul gave Timothy similar, more detailed, instruction in 1 Timothy 1:3-7, explicitly specifying that Timothy “charge certain persons” not to teach doctrine that differed from the teaching of the apostles. (Timothy was sent by Paul to help this church and correct it. Paul is instructing Timothy regarding how to deal with certain people in this church.
This is not prescriptive. This does not empower the author to take action regarding people 1000 miles away. If anything, she ought to be concerned with her own church and not someone else's. But even then we would remind her that if she has a question regarding something going on in her church, she should remain silent and ask her husband at home.
This does not mean people can't evaluate or analyze someone's teaching. We can and should consider whether or not someone is telling us biblical things. We can even tell others that we have some points of disagreement, and why this is.
Further, we do not find in Scripture the carte blanche ability to brand someone a false teacher.
We would certainly concede the author's premise that she is not being divisive by defending correct doctrine. Our question is, can a person have the truth and correct doctrine and still be divisive? The answer to this question, which the author does not consider, is yes.
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Sometimes you’ve just got to laugh at the ways people use God’s Word to advance unbiblical ideas. I thought I’d heard all the Scriptures people employ in efforts to shame those who call out false teachers and/or expose erroneous doctrine, (This is the author's innocuous characterization of the efforts of the Doctrinal Police. Commendably, the author herself is generally more circumspect and polite than some of the more insulting, demeaning, and hateful ones. For example,
Pulpit and Pen: "Might God use coronavirus to wipe the plague of charismaticism off the map and sweep these charlatans into the dustbin of history."
Rev. Anthony Wade: "The bible does not instruct me to pray for wolves, coddle them, or ask them to stop being a wolf. They deserve nothing but my contempt and disdain and the working end of the shepherd's rod."
Jonathan Aigner: "When her vocals reenter, Taya begins sliding around while contorting her body and face, straining for notes. This is nothing short of histrionic. By 4:35, she appears to be approaching an orgasm or a bowel movement."
Lyndon Unger: "Don’t ask for more “holy fire” in your life; you might get cancer when God answers your prayers."
Pulpit and Pen: Podcast: Blowhard McGoatBeard Says Having Church Makes Jesus Look Bad
Pirate Christian: Todd White, Bill Johnson and Benny Hinn Race to China To End the Coronavirus!We would suggest to the author that whatever observations she might have can indeed cause unholy division, if her motivation is done out of anything other than love.
1Co. 13:2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.There is no automatic virtue in raw truth.)
but someone recently broadsided me with a passage I generally use to support calling out enemies of the truth. Look at the passage that she hurled at me:
9 But avoid foolish controversies, genealogies, dissensions, and quarrels about the law, for they are unprofitable and worthless. 10 As for a person who stirs up division, after warning him once and then twice, have nothing more to do with him, 11 knowing that such a person is warped and sinful; he is self-condemned. ~~Titus 3:9-11 (ESV)The application, of course, was that I am warped and self-condemned because I warn against teachers and teachings that compromise the Gospel. (The author is inserting an editorial comment. Is this the stated reason why someone sent her this Scripture? Did the author contact this person to find this out, or rather, is it the way the author characterizes herself?)
By warning against Beth Moore, Rick Warren, Holy Yoga, the Roman Catholic Church, etc, I am engaging in foolish controversies and stirring up division. (Again, did the author's interlocutor tell her this, or is she inserting a self-justifying characterization?)
But am I?
Let’s review the Bible Study I wrote on this very passage back in 2017, shall we? Hopefully we’ll remember the historical context behind this passage and thus better understand Paul’s actual point.
Paul gave Timothy similar, more detailed, instruction in 1 Timothy 1:3-7, explicitly specifying that Timothy “charge certain persons” not to teach doctrine that differed from the teaching of the apostles. (Timothy was sent by Paul to help this church and correct it. Paul is instructing Timothy regarding how to deal with certain people in this church.
This is not prescriptive. This does not empower the author to take action regarding people 1000 miles away. If anything, she ought to be concerned with her own church and not someone else's. But even then we would remind her that if she has a question regarding something going on in her church, she should remain silent and ask her husband at home.
This does not mean people can't evaluate or analyze someone's teaching. We can and should consider whether or not someone is telling us biblical things. We can even tell others that we have some points of disagreement, and why this is.
Further, we do not find in Scripture the carte blanche ability to brand someone a false teacher.
10 But you, why do you judge your brother? Or you again, why do you regard your brother with contempt? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God. 11 For it is written, “As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to Me, And every tongue shall give praise to God.” 12 So then each one of us will give an account of himself to God. 13 Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather determine this—not to put an obstacle or a stumbling block in a brother’s way. Romans 14:10-13)
This parallel passage sheds light on Titus 3:9-11, so allow me to quote it here:
So let’s examine Titus 3:9-11 more carefully.
(...)
Applying Titus 3:9-11 people who call out false teachers and/or expose erroneous doctrine demonstrates a lack of Scriptural knowledge. In one sense, using this passage to silence people who stand against doctrinal error is laughable. But in another sense, it’s very sad.
3 As I urged you when I was going to Macedonia, remain at Ephesus so that you may charge certain persons not to teach any different doctrine, 4 nor to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies, which promote speculations rather than the stewardship from God that is by faith. 5 The aim of our charge is love that issues from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith. 6 Certain persons, by swerving from these, have wandered away into vain discussion, 7 desiring to be teachers of the law, without understanding either what they are saying or the things about which they make confident assertions. (ESV)As with the 1 Timothy 1:3-7 passage, the Titus 3:9-11 passage aims squarely at teachers who deviate from sound doctrine. (And as with Timothy, Paul is writing to tell Titus how to handle certain situations in a church where he has authority and position. Paul did not tell Titus to write a letter to the church in, say, Colossae and correct it. Titus is to deal with the specific problems in a specific church where he has been positioned to act.)
So let’s examine Titus 3:9-11 more carefully.
(...)
Applying Titus 3:9-11 people who call out false teachers and/or expose erroneous doctrine demonstrates a lack of Scriptural knowledge. In one sense, using this passage to silence people who stand against doctrinal error is laughable. But in another sense, it’s very sad.
Hi, I just want to ask you something. I'm sorry if this is a stupid, long post. But there's a guy on the internet who says he's a Christian. However, as well as saying the world is degenerate and needs Jesus, he cusses, contradicts himself, and has a playlist of explicit sexual music. He thinks evil thoughts are not from your own mind or OCD, but from demons. He said in a recent video that demons come through the gamma frequency. He also said this:
ReplyDelete"They're [demons] conditioning, bringing, influencing, and molding your brains to put you in a more immoral and degenerate spiritual state through the things that we consume, such as music and cinema." Yet he watches these movies and listens to this music. One of the things he said on his Tumblr was that Jesus wasn't PC, but I don't know if he thinks Jesus would swear or not. Also, he thinks certain singers have sold their souls to Satan, yet they're on his playlist. He has been called out for lying in the past. He kept promising to do things that never happened. And he threatens to beat you up if you say something derogatory about him. His Tumblr posts would rival the scorched-earth rhetoric on this blog. He says have nothing to do with conspiracy theories, yet one of his favorite books is, "Behold A Pale Horse", and he believes in the Illuminati. He also flip-flops on Trump. One minute he's disappointed with him [he said he might not vote this year because he thinks Trump hasn't done certain things], the next he loves him. He's said this in the past too - that he thinks the Bible is telling him stuff about Trump or that he's disappointed, but then forgets about it the next day. In a Tumblr post before the 2016 election, he sad he wouldn't vote because Jesus is the only savior. And yet he did vote. Another time he contradicted himself was when the conservative, Milo Yiannopoulous made an extremely rude joke about Jesus. This guy called Milo out, yet the next day said Milo's free speech was being violated. When someone makes rude jokes like that, this guy doesn't usually forget about it. Yet he did this time. And yet another time was when an actress from one of his favorite movies said she supported abortion. He said he'd never watch that movie again. But he did watch it again.
So my questions are:
Why would he say the world is a degenerate place and talk about people going to hell, yet listen to explicit music, watch R-rated movies like "Goodfellas", and use foul language? [He also had a podcast, where he would say the F word a lot. And he said he'd try and clean up his language, yet he never does.] And why would he talk about demons brainwashing people through entertainment yet continue to participate in it?
Why would he say certain celebs have sold their souls, yet have them on his playlist? [He likes to talk about having nothing to do with evil.]
One of his best friends is a Muslim rapper who said very offensive things about Jesus. Yet they're still friends. If it was someone else, he'd dump them on the spot.
Why would he talk about beating people up? [He's a MMA fighter, but still.]
Given all these things about his behavior, how do you feel about him talking about lukewarm Christians? Is he behaving no better than them? He calls women "jezebels" and "harlots", and says "fooking" as a substitute for the f-word.
What would you say if you met him? [I'd compare him mostly to Rev Anthony Wade from this blog].
I apologize for the long post, but I really enjoy your blog and reading about the Doctrinal Police.
I appreciate your comments.
ReplyDeleteThese kinds of problems, regarding worldy Christians, are too common. It ultimately requires the intervention if the Holy Spirit in your friends life.
I would say it's a matter of prayer. Ask God to move in his life, to bring conviction. You must be motivated by love and not condemnation or judgment.
Maybe when you think the time is right, ask to pray with him. Together you can ask for the fruit of the Spirit to manifest in both of you.
Study the word Together. Disciple him and allow the word to characterize the relationship between you two.
Whatever is true and lovely... make those things what you fix your minds upon. The light of God's working in you both will change each of you.
I will be praying for you both.
I'm not condemning or judging him. Actually, he's not my friend. He's just someone on the Internet.
ReplyDeleteOh, I see. Then it's simple. Don't listen to his stuff.
ReplyDelete