Alan Caplin
So. When we leave this earth, what happens to our “unrepentant” sin?
THIS was my very FIRST question 25 years ago when I left Judaism and joined a church. And 100% honest truth be told, I was freaking out that I’d drive past some seriously smoking hot looking lady - have some thoughts my wife wouldn’t approve of - and then get hit by a car, die, and have never said “sorry” to God.
The pastors and bible teachers said that God is good and gracious - and that God would handle it. He’d forgive that lust because He loves me. My question was - how?
But I assumed I was wrong for about 20 years. I was even a pastor for a bit - and I left when I couldn’t stomach some of the things we were teaching people.
In reality. All sin on the body of Christ. All. Not some. ALL. Hebrews 9:26-28 clearly says Jesus entered heaven once. He doesn’t jump on and off the cross each time we sin. Jesus doesn’t enter heaven over and over like the Levite priests entered the Holy of Holies.
Once. Done. Our High Priest had a final and perfect performance on the cross.
Hebrews 9:26-28 also says Jesus ALREADY dealt with sin ONCE and will return not to deal with sin, but to bring salvation for those who wait. Sin has been put away.
Can we be disobedient - yes.
Can we do stupid destructive things - yes.
Can we destroy our lives - yes.
Can we harm people we care about - yes.
Can we grieve God - yes.
Can we sabotage plans God has for us - yes.
NT sin is bad. John calls sin wrong-doing and lawlessness. At the root, sin is the fruit of our unbelief.
But the fact remains that ALL sin is paid for. In fact, Jesus was the FULL propitiation or final payment (emphasis added) of sin for all mankind both “our sin” and the unsaved world (1 John 2:2).
Yes. “Behold the Lamb who takes AWAY the sin of the world!” John 1:29
The sin of my unsaved friends and family is paid for as equally as mine.
All. Sin. Once. Done.
So, if all sin is paid for (emphasis added)- why aren’t all people saved? Good question.
Upon BELIEF we like Abraham are credited back as righteousness. See both Romans 4 and Galatians 3. This righteousness or right standing is for those who believe - Romans 3:22.
Sin isn’t a barrier to God. The unbelieving heart is! Hebrews 3:12.
Sin has been dealt with, but God is constantly working on our unbelieving, distant heart.
Back to the opening question.
Any verse talking about losing salvation is spoken to either unbelieving Jewish people - again Hebrews 3:12 - or to false teachers and false prophets who Jude says are unbelievers and never were saved nor have the Holy Spirit.
Nobody in these categories LOST a gift that was freely given.
Jesus says that He came to do the will of the Father and that will is to lose not one given to him and not one snatched from His hand.
For one to be lost. That makes Jesus a liar. And it means He has revoked gifts and calls that cannot be revoked.
Further Hebrews 6 makes it clear this was a covenant cut between God and Jesus - to make sure that WE can’t mess it up. If we were included as a party of the contractual covenant, we’d have to maintain our salvation and make sure that WE don’t mess it up.
How would it be possible that someone would be saved at 18 go through a life of abuse, rape, beatings, and overall hell and then lose her salvation because she had period of doubt - but someone on their death bed carries that salvation football just 2 feet? This makes salvation based on works. Not by grace through faith.
God doesn’t force us to carry HIM from goal line to goal line, HE CARRIES US to the end zone. Folks. That’s grace.
The thief on the cross was justified without good works, tithing, being good, being an elder, etc. Saved simply because God is good and this man believed.
Your spirit is perfect, yet your soul is being transformed. Your spirit is saved, your soul is being saved and working out its salvation.
Beyond initial repentance, we repent to maintain our heavenly relationship, to break off what’s entered through our disobedience, and to right the wrongs between us - not to be cleansed of sin. That was already done and dealt with.
Cats lick themselves to stay clean. Sons are clean simply because of what was promised. John 15:3
9 comments
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Me: Jesus didn't pay for our sin, He paid for us.
Shane: Rich, He certainly did make propitiation/atonement for our sin…
”And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.“
BIBLE.COM
I John 2:2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world. | New King James Version (NKJV)
Me: Shane, agreed. But "propitiation" doesn't mean "paid for," it means to appease or turn away wrath.
Shane: Rich, the word propitiation also occurs in Hebrews 2:17: “Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people.”
Here the expression “to make propitiation” means to put away by paying the penalty.
Shane: "Now Paul tells us in Romans 3:25 that God set Christ forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith. We are not told to put our faith in His blood; Christ Himself is the object of our faith. It is only a resurrected and living Christ Jesus who can save. He is the propitiation. Faith in Him is the condition by which we avail ourselves of the propitiation. His blood is the price that was paid." -- MacDonald, W. (1995). Believer’s Bible Commentary: Old and New Testaments (A. Farstad, Ed.; pp. 1689–1690). Thomas Nelson.
Me: Shane, I don't mean to dispute, I have such great respect for you. However, the idea that Jesus paid for our sin is not found in the Bible. There is no verse that tells us that Jesus paid for our sins, or that the sacrificial animals of the OT paid for the sins of Israel.
The spilled blood is the effective agent of forgiven sin: "without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness." (Hebrews 9:22) This is a sacrificial transaction, not a financial or legal transaction.
The definition of propitiation you provided is the Calvinistic perspective, which I cannot accept. Every source I consulted agrees with my initial statement that propitiation is the appeasement or turning away of wrath:
https://biblehub.com/greek/2434.htmhttps://biblehub.com/greek/2433.htmhttps://biblehub.com/greek/2435.htm
Me: Here's a more detailed analysis from my blog: https://mountainmantrails.blogspot.com/2022/03/did-jesus-satisfy-our-legal-obligation.html
MOUNTAINMANTRAILS.BLOGSPOT.COM
Did Jesus satisfy our legal obligation? Did He pay our debt?
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